Recently Donald Trump took a shot at Dr. Ben Carson by implying that Carson’s Seventh-Day Adventism was not mainstream and might not be accepted by evangelicals as being within the orthodoxy of Christianity while also implying that Trump is a mainstream Christian. While it is true that the denomination is believed to be a cult by some, most Christian scholars say they are within Christian orthodoxy.
What is it that this denomination teaches that makes some Christians question the orthodoxy of Seventh-Day Adventists? Also, Trump should have known that it is not wise for those in glass houses to throw stones. What do we know about Trump’s own Christian identity?
The Adventism of the Millerites of 1845 is different from the Adventism of today but strange aberrant beliefs still do exist in the Seventh-day Adventist Church. Even so, most Christian leaders claim the Adventists believe the essentials of the Christian faith so they should not be labeled a cult. I will lay out some of the facts on Christianity that Trump and Carson identify with and let the readers decide where the truth lies.
Donald Trump threw the first stone as if he is a mainstream Christian because he was once baptized in a Presbyterian USA church (one of the most liberal denominations in the United States that even performs same-sex marriage). Don’t get me wrong, I like Trump, but he does like to throw stones at opponents. The following is from CNN and the first and last paragraph is quoting Trump:
“I am Presbyterian Protestant. I go to Marble Collegiate Church,” he told reporters in Greenville, S.C.
Marble Collegiate Church was founded in 1628 and is one of the oldest continuous Protestant denominations in the country. The church is part of the Reformed Church in America denomination and is on Fifth Avenue in Manhattan.
Trump has expressed admiration for Dr. Norman Vincent Peale, the author of the self-help book “The Power of Positive Thinking,” and the pastor at Marble Collegiate Church for 52 years from 1932 until 1984, according to the church website. Peale died in 1993.
“Dr. Norman Vincent Peale, The Power of Positive Thinking was my pastor,” Trump said Tuesday. “To this day one of the great speakers I’ve seen. You hated to leave church. You hated when the sermon was over. That’s how great he was at Marble Collegiate Church.” (bold emphasis is mine)
Dr. Norman Vincent Peale believed in Universalism. He was a heretic. His book helped start the positive confession movement that now plagues Christianity. Peale was the mentor of Robert Schuller. Both believed in Universalism. They did not believe in judgment, they believed that all major world religions contained paths to God and all people would be saved eventually.
Positive confession was recently recycled as The Secret and popularize by people like Oprah Winfrey who pushes New Spirituality (recycled New Age teaching). Word of Faith Theology also spouts much of the same positive thinking and positive confession drivel that Peale and Schuller popularized. Only they take it to another level where the spoken words of Christians contain creative power.
Trump says he is a Presbyterian, but he claims to attend Marble Collegiate Church. Marble Collegiate Church is not a Presbyterian church. It it is in the Reformed Church of America denomination. The same denomination as was Peale and Robert Schuller. And the present pastor of that church said Trump is not an active member of their church.
Donald Trump should not be throwing stones at the Seventh-day Adventist denomination from the foundation of Robert Schuller’s Glass Cathedral. Peale was out of that church pulpit over thirty years ago. Since then maybe Trump was mostly attending Robert Schuller’s Hour of Power program on his home TV listening to Schuller’s “what you can believe you can achieve spiel”. With Peale’s power of positive thinking firmly set in Trump’s mind, it is no wonder that Trump now likes the gospel of Paula White. He recently had her invite like-minded “Christian” media leaders to meet with him. It appears to me that Paula White replaced Peale and Schuller as Trump’s positive confession media Guru.
Paula White is a “Word of Faith” speak it into existence Dominion Theology false prophet and prosperity huckster. Maybe I should not blame Trump for thinking that Christianity is some identity with those who believe they can speak their imaginations or delusions into reality. That probably is all the “Christianity” Trump has ever been exposed to. The people he listens to don’t know the true gospel themselves. With the positive confession background that Trump apparently follows and seems to spout himself, he might become a mouthpiece for the Harlot of Revelation 17 if he is ever elected to the presidency.
After that observation and some admitted speculation about Donald Trump’s “Christianity”, I can now get to Dr. Ben Carson’s Seventh-day Adventist denomination.
Overview:
The Seventh-day Adventists descended from the Millerite movement. William Miller claimed that Jesus would return in 1843 but when that did not happen he firmly fixed the date to be in 1844. After the “Great Disappointment” of 1844, Hiram Edson claimed that they had misunderstood. He claimed that Jesus did not to come to earth that year because the sanctuary to be cleansed was not on earth it was in Heaven.
Edson claimed that in 1844 Jesus moved from the Holy Place in the sanctuary in heaven to the Most Holy Place. Jesus has now been cleansing the Most Holy part of the sanctuary since 1844. The Seventh-Day Adventists call what Jesus is doing the “investigative judgment”. (He is examining the lives of all converts to determine who lived out a life worthy to receive eternal life). After the investigative judgment is complete, and Jesus determines those worthy of eternal life (based on how they lived). The resurrection of the just will take place and they will go with Jesus. The rest of humanity living on the earth will die in the judgment and will sleep until the resurrection of the unjust.
Much of what Adventists believe is based on the visions and writings of Ellen G. White. The domination claims that Ellen White received the “Spirit of Prophecy”. They claim she restored the gift of prophecy. The “gift” was given to her to help instruct their denomination. White joined with other Adventist leaders to form the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
Over the years, there were teachings from some within the Seventh-day Adventist denomination that the more contemporary denominational leadership could not sanction. Therefore, official Seventh-day Adventist doctrine was established in 1957. It is found in a volume called “Questions on Doctrine”. Any doctrine that is not in agreement with “Questions on Doctrine” is not the position of the denomination.
One thing must be understood or they would certainly would fall in the cult category. They do not believe that Ellen White was on the same level as the biblical prophets. It is more like what Pentecostals believe about their so-called anointed prophets of today. The big different is that there was only one woman who received the “spirit of prophecy” for Adventists. They do say that the Bible is the only infallible authority.
Points on their doctrine:
They are orthodox on the major points of Christian Theology as to scripture being the highest authority, the nature of Christ, atonement for sin, the plan of salvation, the return of Jesus, and the resurrection of the just and unjust.
However, in spite of these orthodox positions they also have some rather contrived doctrines that most in Christendom do not accept. They support their aberrant beliefs with scripture, but they use very bad hermeneutics to do so. They seem to make scripture conform to Adventist doctrine and not the other way around.
They do not deny essential doctrines of the faith, but they make fanciful leaps of ill-logic to support what some might call secondary doctrines. They seem to rely more on the writings of Ellen White than on any sound Bible exegesis. If you ask me, their unique interpretations of Revelation and other prophetic scriptures is simply pathetic.
All of their following doctrines are based on wrong assumptions or wrong interpretations of scriptures that can be refuted by using other scriptures, correct hermeneutics, and the historical record of the Church. God is not the author of confusion but the Seventh-day Adventist denomination can be.
- They generally teach that Christendom changed the Sabbath to Sunday – Most in Christendom never took the view that the Sabbath was changed to Sunday. Most in Christendom worship and assemble on the first day of the week that they call the Lord’s Day because Jesus rose from the dead on that day. The Sabbath always has been and is the last day of the week and most in Christendom acknowledge that truth.
- They think they are the only denomination that keeps the Sabbath and all the Ten commandments – They if fact, do not properly keep the Sabbath according to the Law (ask any Orthodox Jew). Those in Christ do not need to keep laws that were only given to lead people to Christ. Those in Christ that love God and their neighbor through the indwelling Holy Spirit are keeping the totality of God’s Law.
- They believe that only the Ten Commandments is the eternal Law. They believe because they keep the Sabbath they alone are the commandment keeping visible Church – The Law in fact, is much more than just keeping the ten commandments. Even so, all Law is fulfilled in Christ. The Law was to bring us to Christ. Those in Christ are to life by the higher new commandment of love (Joh 13:34, 1Jo 2:8, 2Jo 1:5).
- They believe that if your break the Ten Commandments you can lose your salvation. They do not believe a person’s conversion to Christ seals their salvation – They claim you are saved by grace alone but then they add this works theology to stay saved. (Actually most in Christendom believe this error, so if Adventists are cultists because they believe conversion to Christ does not equate to salvation, they have a lot of company in what is called Christendom.)
- They say that Adventists can fully know if they are saved if they understand and accept the teachings of the Seventh-day Adventist Church – Other denominations also make such claims. Does that mean people also have to understand and accept the errors of the denomination? Does the Bible teach that people can know they are saved by understanding and accepting any visible church? I think not.
- They say Sunday worship is the mark of the Beast – They say this time of testing of loyalty only goes into effect after it has been announced by the angel. (Me thinks they do not have a clue about what is the Mark of the Beast.)
- They believe in soul sleep – they think there is no consciousness after death until the resurrections.
- They do not believe in eternal judgement of the wicked – they believe in total annihilation.
- They believe that Jesus and Michael are the same. – they believe Michael was just a different name for Jesus. They do not believe that Jesus was a created angel like the Jehovah Witnesses cult.
- They believe that Satan and his angels will be confined to roam a depopulated earth for one thousand years. The earth will have no humans living on it until the resurrection of the unjust after the thousand years is over. – they simply do not understand what Revelation and the prophets teach.
- They try to obey the dietary laws of the Old Testament. – They say Christians should obey these laws for health reasons and because the body is the Temple of the Holy Spirit. Why many of them think the Bible also instructs them to refrain from eating meat is beyond me? They also refrain from other things they believe are harmful to the body. For example, alcohol, smoking, and voting for socialists (okay, I am kidding about voting for Democrats but socialists have proved to be deadly for the bodies of Christians).
- They believe they are the only visible remnant Church mentioned in Revelation 12:17 – They say it is not pride that makes them say that. They say it is true because only their domination has the correct prophetic interpretation. They do say there are Christians in all denominations (they believe in an invisible Church) but say they are the only true visible Church on earth).
My observations:
It seems to me that their “Questions on Doctrine” was specifically written to try to make them fit within Christian orthodoxy. Even so, the aberrant theology retained does not dispel the thinking that Seventh-day Adventism is not orthodox.
I also think it is ironic that a denomination that thinks keeping the Ten Commandments is a requirement to retain salvation should so easily break one of them in their proselytizing methods. They disguise who they are because they know people would not be open to their doctrine if they knew they were Seventh-day Adventists. There is a commandment against lying and deception is lying even if Adventists use it as a means to an end. Remember, Jesus made it clear in the Sermon on the Mount that keeping the commandments perfectly was not just following the letter of the Law.
I also do not like that they deceive people through “Bible prophecy seminars” as if only their “Bible Prophecy experts” know the future. The Seventh-day eschatology was screwed-up from the start and it is still all screwed-up. They cannot get Bible prophecy correct because they twist prophetic scripture to make it support their aberrant theology.
So, because Adventism is not orthodox in some respects should Seventh-day Adventism be called a cult? I think they have made some efforts to appear to be orthodox but theologically it seems to me they still could be labeled a Christian cult and they still are by some.
I think the doctrinal emphasis of each individual church within the denomination would determine their cult status to me. To say the dominion is a cult suggests the denomination as a whole does not teach essentials of the faith. It really is not that simple with the Adventists because you can find salvation through the doctrine of the Seventh-day Adventist Church.
The real problem is what they believe is required to keep salvation. Their legalistic requirements might be considered within Christianity orthodoxy because much of Christendom also believes such error. However, any teaching that condemns an unknown number of Christian converts to hell or annihilation based on one’s own performance is not true Christian doctrine.
I do find it difficult to understand how true Christians that claim to read the Bible and say that the Bible is their final authority can still embrace so much aberrant doctrine. However, I could say the same thing about those in many other denominations.
Does Dr. Ben Carson really believe all that the Seventh-day Adventist teach, or is it partly a social and cultural thing? He does claim to attend churches in other denominations and he does downplay denominations. He strongly conveys that his own personal relationship with Jesus Christ is what drives him.
Everything I know about Dr. Carson enforces my belief that he is a true Christian.
Everything I know about Donald Trump enforces my belief that he only has a Christian identity.
Everything I know about the Seventh-day Adventist Church tell me that I would never go there.
What do you think?
Good synopsis. What comes to mind with regard to the 7th day Adventists….since they add the requirement of keeping the commandments to maintain salvation, I believe Galatians 1:8 comes into play here. Seems to me that Paul would say they were anathema. Also, considering the twisting they do to future prophecy, Rev. 22:19 could apply. I agree with you, that in regards to Adventists, you have to take it person by person. That being said, if they are truly born again, I believe the Holy Spirit will eventually lead them out of that church. What the denomination teaches is not orthodox, because they add to it.
Donald Trump is just identifying with Christianity because it serves his purposes.
Hi Jen,
Good observations. I am not sure about Trump just identifying with Christianity because it serves his purpose through. I am reasonably sure that he is not a true Christian but when you consider his identifying with positive confession people and his positive message about making America great again and his association with Paula White. Trump might actually believe that just claiming what he says will make that happen. In other words, Trump may have bought into the Pseudo Christian false gospel of the TV Word of Faith prosperity teachers.
I’m glad Don wrote this article because I wasn’t sure what 7th Day Adventists believed. My limited exposure to them was an employer/employee relationship. They weren’t nice people but judgement can’t be passed on the whole from a few. I think the same can be said about The Word of Faith people. I left that movement but I do know quite a few people whose salvation I don’t doubt who believed the hocus pocus positive thinking words have power spiel.
I do wish Trump would be more discreet because I really like him but I’m still as confused about what he believes as he seems to be. When you referred to the Reformed Churches, Don, did you mean the Reformed Presbyterian? I actually joined a local Reformed Presbyterian back in the 80’s. I didn’t know much bible then but I knew my friends there were as dedicated to the Lord Jesus as my Baptists relatives were. I only discovered later that they believed we were in the millennium reign now; they’re Calvinists, and I couldn’t take communion with them unless I was a member.
I’m still at the start. Where do the candidates stand on the issues? Who is most qualified to lead America out of the mess we’re in? (If possible.) Who has the best chance of beating the Democratic candidate? (Probably Hillary.) We still don’t know who the RNP will nominate. That’s why I think it’s so important to vote in the primaries. If your state holds them early enough to have your voice count. Texas is March 1.
Caitlin,
The only thing I said about “Reformed” is that Trump claims to attend a church in the Reformed Church of America denomination. That is the denomination, It is not Presbyterian. Those that say they are reformed say their beliefs go back to the reformation. That however, is an oversimplification, many denominations that came out of the reformation do not identify with those calling them reformed today. Reformed today pretty much equates to believing in the five points of Calvinism. The reformed also generally believe in Covenant Theology and Amillennial Theology. I believe neither is correct. I believe in Dispensation Theology and Premillennial Theology.
If Normal Peale and Robert Schuller are any reflection of their denomination they certainly do not reflect the beliefs of the reformation or the Calvinists that now identify with Reformed Theology.
Presbyterians generally are in the reformed camp but the Church Trump claims to attend is not Presbyterian. My point was that Trump made a big thing about being a Presbyterian and then he did not even go to one. He went to a church of a heretic that taught Universalism. Now he identifies with Word of Faith leaders. They generally have Arminian Theology.
Don, There is no appropriate place to put this comment yet but since you’ve written some on church doctrine I hope you accept it here.
I’m quite upset right now. Franklin Graham has used the 2 Chronicles 7:14 verse to apply to “healing our land.” (The United States of America.) Ann Graham Lotz has used it before and now Franklin is.
I commented on his post that those were instructions for Israel and couldn’t be taken out of context and applied to the church or our nation. Immediately the replies started coming in from other readers to show me I am wrong.
I know you wrote about this last year because I printed your article. I said to them “Just read it in it’s context.” then I ran and hid because I’m over my head in what else to say.
Hi Caitlin,
The best you can do for them is to go there and post a link to my article. You can lead a horse to water but you can’t make it drink.
2 Ch 7:14: If My people read the context there would be less presumption
Keep in mind that some people will just believe anything that their leaders tell them. The people in America that can still think for themselves today is a very small percentage and that includes Christians that went through our Public Fool System.
Some people actually think that America is Christian so that passage applies. They are confused and probably have big tent Christianity. That is true of Billy and Franklin Graham. However, America is far from being a Christian nation.
If Christians actually needed to humble themselves and pray, it would be wise for them to do that. However, talking about it and doing it are two different things. Even so, working out one’s own sanctification would not change the demonic in our nation. Only mass conversion to Christ solves spiritual problems. Anyway I explain it all in the article.
Word of Faith and TV prosperity preachers are pushing this concept just like they push The Harbinger and Blood Moons and just like they cherry pick other scriptures to make God’s word say what they want. They want others to think they are uniquely anointed and know the things of God and have a God given solution for the nation. However, they don’t.
The truth is that most people in America today will not abide by the moral teaching of Christianity. For if they did, they would not be electing the demonic to office and changing Christian cultural to a deadly antichrist culture. Some polls may lie but not all the polls lie. Many American’s have already been given over to a reprobate mind (Romans One). How does Christian fasting and prayer stop God’s judgment on those that hate Him?
Don, I have your link and the article. I will post it. I like the Grahams but I was upset that Franklin used this 7:14 verse. So many people pay attention to what he says. I believe he said he’s going to take the message to every state capitol next year so I expect another ‘run’ on how to heal our land.
Not too long ago Ann used the blood moons to make a point. I also commented on that. That didn’t turn out well for me either. lol.
I really really hope that some will check out your website. Thank you
I have to somewhat disagree about how Adventists see White. On a personal level, most I’ve come across defend her as being a modern day prophet equal to the OT prophets. Officially, they hold the same position as can be seen by their defenses of her plagiarism and the article “Is the Bible Our Final Authority?” which can be found on the SDA Biblical Research Institute website. After inferring that the Bible may contain human error, written from man’s perspective and other issues of interpretation, the author (referring to White under the Holy Spirit’s guidance) writes:
“With the immense advantage of the gift of prophecy in modern times, Adventists are prepared for a genuinely integrated understanding of revelation, inspiration, and preservation of authority in the Word while others explore box canyons in search of understanding. But we will fall short of God’s plan unless we allow the Holy Spirit to both interpret the Word and move it into proclamation.”
Incidentally, Grace to You’s Phil Johnson has done some great work on SDA. I haven’t linked the sites here as I am unaware of you policy re that.
Hi Alf,
Thanks for the additional information.
All I know is what was said by the Adventists in defense of their orthodoxy as it was documented in the “Kingdom of the Cults”, by Dr. Walter Martin and my research on the internet. I suppose like other denominations there are differences of opinions even at the leadership level. I also suspect that what the denomination said about Ellen White in “Questions on Doctrine” was an effort to try to appease the Christian critics. I am sure that many Adventists think that she got direct private revelation from God. That is why I implied that even by Christian orthodoxy standards some individual church leaders may meet the standards and others might not.
I was not aware that the Adventists think the Bible may contain human error. That was not mentioned by Dr. Martin.
I believe that Dr. Martin once may have believed they were a cult but when he did the research himself for his book he came to the conclusion that the official position of the domination in “Questions on Doctrine” met his test of Christian orthodoxy. Therefore he did not include them as a cult but he uniquely wrote a big section about them in his classic book. Dr. Martin could have been mislead or misinformed in his own research. Also, I think he was focusing more on Salvation Theology. He probably gave them a pass on their passages on eschatology because Dr. Walter Martin was a bit confused about Eschatology himself.
There is no question that the theology of the Seventh-Day Adventists is aberrant. I can see why some even label it a cult.
My policy on links is that if it helps support what your saying in your comment, or adds light to my article, then by all means include them.
Have you written on Cruz yet? Since we are looking at candidates spiritual sides, I heard he and his dad are very involved in dominionism. It surely makes me wonder how their religious beliefs will affect their policy. I have to agree that we need a strong, bold leader now is we have any hope at all. I can see a Trump/Cruz ticket. There’s something about Carson I’m sensing that puts me off. More so than the other two who look to be the only other options. That’s if someone doesn’t disappear Trump or Cruz.
Hi Jerialice,
I did write on Cruz right here on this blog.
https://www.thepropheticyears.com/enddepravity/2016-presidential-candidates-fiorina-rubio-and-cruz.html
Cruz’s religious beliefs drive his policy.
11 June 2016 / 6 Sivan 5776 / Pentecost
Hi Don,
It’s been awhile since I have visited your site. I hope this is not off topic, but I read that David Koresh was involved in the Church of Seventh Day Adventists. It was reported that he was kicked out because of bad behavior, and he eventually took over the Branch Davidian Cult in Waco, Texas. And we all know how that ended.
Irrespective of what the SDA Church teaches, I have a feeling that Vernon Howell has a special place reserved just for him.
Consider this passage from the Holy Scriptures:
Jude 1:8-13 “Likewise also these filthy dreamers defile the flesh, despise dominion, and speak evil of dignities.
Yet Michael the archangel, when contending with the devil he disputed about the body of Moses, durst not bring against him a railing accusation, but said, The Lord rebuke thee.
But these speak evil of those things which they know not: but what they know naturally, as brute beasts, in those things they corrupt themselves.
Woe unto them! for they have gone in the way of Cain, and ran greedily after the error of Balaam for reward, and perished in the gainsaying of Core.
These are spots in your feasts of charity, when they feast with you, feeding themselves without fear: clouds they are without water, carried about of winds; trees whose fruit withereth, without fruit, twice dead, plucked up by the roots;
Raging waves of the sea, foaming out their own shame; wandering stars, to whom is reserved the blackness of darkness for ever.”
Forever is never ending, so complete annihilation is obviously just a “feel good” doctrine that causes people who do not know God, or do not obey the true Gospel of Jesus Christ, to not be too worried about their final destination.
Hell IS REAL! And so is Heaven! And I truly want to persuade others to set their affections on the things above, and not on the earth, because this world is passing away, and WILL burn up one day. And only our relationship with Jesus Christ will matter in the end.
I would like to share a word of encouragement posted at my site:
This life is very hard to bear at times, but I pray that God will be with you in your journey. The “True Light,” shines the brightest in the night, and it is only through Jesus Christ that we can hold out until the end. And please remember, “the darkest hour is just before the dawn!”
You are in my prayers! Keep the faith my brothers and sisters in the LORD! God bless and keep you, always!
With the love of Christ,
C. Read